Future pharma: Trends and takeaways from Digital Pharma East

[00:01] Through all the omnichannel marketing and omnichannel channel and targeting the thing that clicked for me was omnichannel messaging. So it has to remain that consistent. The one thing that’s the same on the other end. Is that recipient of that message you always wonder is this here to stay right or is this going to be more a momentary flash in the pan? [00:22] I think now you’re starting to see the collective realization that this is something special and it really could be life-saving for patients and allow us to be faster and smarter in a world that’s increasingly digital. [00:40] Hi, my name is Lecia Bushak and I’m a senior reporter at MM+M. [00:45] I’m super excited to be part of today’s sponsored podcast with senecas health. I’m here today with Oliver Nelson managing director of Evolvics powered by Syneos Health and Matt Snodgrass AI Innovation lead at Syneos Health and they’re here to talk about the future of Pharma the main Trends and takeaways from Digital Pharma East 2024. [01:15] Oliver and Matt thanks so much for being here. Great. Thanks for having us. Thank you. So you were both at digital Pharma East last week. I was as well. There are a lot of interesting new trends emerging in your mind. What was the most significant Trends or new innovations that you observed there? So while last year the theme was very clearly and very chilled obviously omnichannel this year was was a lot of the same but AI was interestingly pervasive throughout as well. It was either, you know, I guided the sessions that I wanted to attend after looking at the men I would say probably about 20 to 30% of them were had AI mentioned somewhere in the title, but I don’t think I attended to session through the rest of the entire conference where AI wasn’t mentioned once or twice or 50 times throughout the course of the session as well. So that was that was a pretty pervasive theme whether it was [02:15] You know the intent was hcp or omnichannel or Media or patient AI was definitely not just on the horizon, but trying to figure out how to implement at this point. [02:26] Yeah, and I would say interestingly on the other side of that too A lot of the questions that we received directly and also heard throughout the conference really related to okay. But so how do we successfully incorporate that through the mlr review process? And I think there were a lot of [02:44] themes around infrastructure and constraints perceived constraints from you know, having sort of that that legal perspective Nimble enough and open enough to really take full advantage of a lot of the technologies that were being discussed. I think that’s going to be an interesting not that collectively as a industry. We’re going to have to do a better job at cracking and ensuring that we’ve got, you know, those back-end processes now catching up to where the Innovation is on the Leading Edge in terms of the way. We’re thinking about showing up in Market taking advantage of the speed at which AI allows us to iterate and be personal in our messaging. How do we make sure that the Regulators are [03:29] comfortable with that and able to successfully sign off on frankly. What a lot of the other Industries are already doing. [03:37] Absolutely, one of the things I noticed compared to last year is that you know AI was sort of this novelty in this buzzword last year and this year, you know, DPE was really all about the nuanced ways that it’s been it’s being Incorporated. So the conversations were a little bit deeper. Were there any particular sessions or speakers that stood out to you and what made them impactful? [03:58] Yeah, I think there were some interesting takes from Pharma clients themselves. They seemed very much in a want and a need to get to this next level. So when it comes to [04:12] Hyper targeted omnichannel access both on the hcp and the DTC side and as Oliver mentioned they’re definitely looking for AI to help in that solution and they almost had an impassioned plea when it comes to as Oliver mentioned mlr one of them mentioned something that we you know was kind of a I saw it was kind of a bomb drop in the room when he said when it comes to mlr and the way that the speed at which this is moving now, he sees the entire mlr process meaning to be deconstructed and reconstructed again, you know, this is coming through and quicker faster and more variety of content the ability to do so more data and another theme that they said was more data means they want more insights and as mentioned not only with mlr needing to be comfortable with this new AI Revolution. There’s a scale of content that’s going to start to flow through [05:08] and many of them were saying that they will see mlr as the bottleneck to that process. [05:13] Now when it comes to the broader industry trends that you saw discussed at the conference. How do you see those shaping the future of the Pharma industry and were there any specific surprising shifts or emerging technologies that really caught your attention? Yeah, I think one of the trends is really looking at how we think through getting our impactful messages in front of hcps healthcare providers. I think you know, it’s it’s sort of that Open Secret that well, you know https, they’re burned out. They’re you know, there’s a lot of competition for their time everyone’s trying to advertise to them. But I think this year we really kind of heard some interesting stats. I know Matt and I were talking about how one of the session’s referenced that, you know, one of the reasons that hcp’s are really leaving the industries because of all the paperwork they have to do right. So here we’re talking about a digital Focus conference. We’re talking about emerging Technologies and yet things like paperwork Crossing T’s [06:13] The eyes are still pushing hcps out the door with everything else that they’re expected to do. But I think coming out of that is this recognition is the empathy that the hcp is like us right? They are people they have interests. They have hobbies. They have a life that extends outside of when they have the lab coat on and I think as marketers what’s really powerful what came out in many of the sessions is the success that can be had when we rethink when and where some of our messages should be appearing for each. Gp’s right take advantage of these blue. Jean moments where they are pursuing those Hobbies or pursuing those interests, right? And in many cases it gives us that opportunity. [06:58] To stand out from a otherwise cluttered and busy environment when we’re able to think about how to successfully engage those hcps and those moments and reduce a little bit that burden of them having to fight so hard to find the information they need. Well, let’s figure out how we get it to them more elegantly and easier so that hopefully we’re proving that overall experience for them when they’re engaging With Our Brands. It went one of the funny things. I heard at the course of the conference was everyone talks about the amount of work that they’re facing in paperwork and visitations that they have during their their white coat time. I heard the new to me, but I heard a new term there called pajama time where that’s when they’re having to learn that’s when they’re having to go online. Go on social media go on ceremony doximity get all the information that they can’t do during their work day and it’s and it’s tough It’s sad that they are offering so much of their time to patient. [07:58] During their work day that they have to be forced to have this pajama time to complete the level of their work and their profession absolutely and you know when it comes to digital transformation, what role do you think that’s going to play in the farm industry over the next few years? Well, I think what it does is it it makes it that much more important for us to think about how we’re sequencing our messaging. [08:23] And how really we’re transforming. [08:26] The approach from hey, let’s have a single call to action approved by mlr that we’re going to have out the marketplace and really hope it drives change instead. [08:36] Now we have the opportunity to harness this technology. And as Matt said it’s going to create a lot more content right we can be. [08:42] Fast to Market with more messages and really a designed approach to help bring hcp’s and really even patients caregivers right through what we would consider the old conversion funnel. Right? But instead of one message over and over again, now, what we need to do is take advantage of this content and figure out as marketers how we sequence it and in which channels [09:11] So that our brand is now having a conversation with the audience, right? It’s anticipating their mindset. It’s helping to meet them where they are in their journey of going from naive. Maybe they don’t know anything about our brand or maybe they don’t know anything about our mechanism of action, right and bringing them down in a logical path towards Discovery and towards wanting to take the action as marketers for hoping they do whether that’s ultimately righting a script whether that’s you know, accomplishing key actions right in a in a cider ecosystem that we’ve designed. [09:45] So inevitably that’s what’s going to be required of us. Not just from a hey, we have all this great content, but now it’s do we have the infrastructure to serve it when and where it needs to be served and do we have the legal support and the nimbleness to make sure that we’re keeping up with what the audience needs to be successful because we know other brands will be innovating and other areas within the space would be innovating. So if we don’t now we face that conundrum of falling behind, yeah, that’s that’s one of the biggest takeaways I got from actually the evolving and Addison Whitney session was that the traditional marketing funnel you can almost in essence toss that out because it’s Oliver mentioned any given audience is it depends on where they are when they are what channel they’re on a certain platform what kind of state of mind they’re in and in their work or home life. Well, there’s still the same person. That’s the constant right that message has to be consistent and through all the omnichannel marketing and Omni Channel. [10:45] Channel and targeting the thing that clicked for me was on the channel messages. So it has to remain that consistent because again, the one thing that’s the same on the other end. Is that recipient of that message and this might be a good example where AI is being used to what degree will AI play a role in this digital transformation. I think it’s going to be and again, this is a topic that’s really tough for our space. [11:10] Um, which is a dynamic messaging, you know, having a set of messages that are right for a variety of people a variety of situations a variety of levels across that that marketing funnel a variety of channels a variety of images, but and dynamically what’s capable today is pairing them together and piecing them together like a puzzle. [11:32] That is assembled within microseconds right at the time that’s relevant for that person where they are when they are who they are. But the issue is again back to mlr they need to review every iteration every permutation of creative that comes out. So if we can get to the point where they’re approving the puzzle pieces and the end puzzle is a variety of end results. I think that’s going to be a huge leap forward because AI is going to be able to see [12:02] Where and when and who is that person at the moment of the connection and then as quickly assemble the right message for them at that moment so that it’s personalized one of the sessions talked about nudges. It’s not necessarily advertising messages, but that last little nudge to push them over the edge. That’s that’s at the right time and it’s relevant. So I think that’s going to be a hugely forward and look I think we can do it. What’s interesting is a lot of mlr viewers already have experience with this even if they don’t think they do Google several years back right changed the paid search landscape when they introduced the RSA ad format responsive ads and really that is a simplified version of everything. Matt is talking about right now. You have a search algorithm, right dictating different components of [12:52] A written ad and assembling them in different variations to test what’s most effective so we’ve been able to navigate that and there’s been some Innovative salts for concept reviews with mlr and different approaches for gaining blanket approval for you know, this add this destination page. So I have confidence that we will get there but the scale now that we’re talking about where it’s not just your your small written reminder ads for for search. Now, we’re talking about virtually any piece of digital content having the ability to be almost custom assembled right based on some existing business rules with the brand and based on some some existing research and findings about the audience. Now, you’re really kind of opening up the spigot and I think that’s where over the next year. We’re going to see a lot of pressure being applied to the way we’ve always done things from the mlr perspective in order to take advantage of these technology. That’s where the Innovation is going to [13:51] To occur behind the scenes. Yeah, and it’s funny because one of the other things that we heard from The Regulators and and this was a great digital Pharma East. I really enjoyed this one and you know, the the very last session of the very last days always, you know, people were catching flights or leaving and that was the regulatory session. That’s the one I really wanted to watch as the regulatory nerd. [14:14] And that’s one of the ones I enjoyed the most and their message pervasive across all The Regulators on the panel was we are your partners. We are not a service area. We don’t want to be treated as a service area because we both work for the same company. We want success just like YouTube. So if you come to us with some of these innovative ways of marketing like Oliver’s talking about [14:37] talk us through it educate us on it get us in together so that we can walk this journey together and don’t expect you’re going to show up with the brand new dog and pony show and say, oh, I hope you approve this copy for me because you know, one of the things that I said for years when it comes to mlr PRC teams is when they don’t know the answers going to be no. [14:58] So it’s really it comes down to education and bringing them along as a partner. Absolutely. It sounds like you know, that was one of the takeaways is that marketers need to be partnering with Regulators more and viewing it really as a partnership. We are working together. [15:12] Um when it comes to the digital transformation for patient engagement, how is the approach to Patient engagement evolving in the digital age? Yeah. I think that this is where it’s definitely the pictures a little less clear, right? Because I think what you’re starting to see across the board rightfully. So is a resounding step back towards more heightened scrutiny on on privacy, right? How are we using targeting an information to you know be precise to our audience and what’s interesting is I ended up getting into a great conversation between sessions with some folks from different Publishers and agencies and we were on the topic of rare disease. And what’s interesting is I think some of the fundamentals that have persisted throughout the approach to finding rare patients really well apply now a little bit more across the board as privacy continues to heighten is if you’re a brand in and you are there to help [16:12] A rare disease population right right off the bat. We know statistically it’s going to be a small group. So it’s really hard when you look at some of the existing tools that have been on the marketplace up until now that really rely on a lot of data to be statistically significant and precise with targeting you already were struggling there. Even before some of the increased scrutiny on privacy and the approach that a lot of brands have taken is we’ll leave no patient behind right? So let’s take advantage of some of the other powerful attributes digital has to offer like efficiency at scale being Nimble being able to turn on turn off on not necessarily being stuck in lengthy contracts from the media perspective where a lot of dollars are at rest, but let’s think instead about, you know, increasing our chances where we can define those patients, but then knowing that there’s going to be that balance between how precise we can get and also then not missing them and then not, you know heaven forbid. They’re searching they’re putting their hands up and they never find that [17:12] treatment or they never find that offering that can make such a significant impact in their life. [17:17] So I think a lot of those those key takeaways and that balance that really is existed for a while from a rare disease space that’s going to be the conversation more and more at scale. When we think about respecting the various privacy laws that will be in place in some cases state to state right not even a uniform approach. So what is our agreement? Right? What do we do to ensure that we’re respecting that privacy, but then all so thinking through efficiently tactically the best way to make sure that we maximize the chances that those patients and caregivers who matter most to us. We’ll still see our message and still be able to interact with something that’s personalized given their their mindset without becoming the creepy big brother. Yeah, and it’s when we’re approaching the time of just expanding and heightened content creation and expanded targeting capabilities and expanded AI usage and that’s expanded need for mlr. [18:15] The other elephant in the room is data governance and it’s something that’s been really coming to the Forefront of our conversations since the Advent of gdpr right out of Europe and it’s funny because that gave us a little vision into the future because this fairly sweeping set of regulations that come out of Europe we have to account for because these companies operate AS Global organizations. They they can’t you know, [18:41] Target and use data usage that’s just going to satisfy gdpr within the geographic confines the gdpr they have to adopt these globally because they operate as a global company. Well, then you take that down to a state-by-state level whether it’s the introduction of ccba or or Regional DPA regulations. Now you have out of Washington state the My Health my data act that is going to similarly on a micro scale affect how they operate on a Statewide if not Global level out of one single state. [19:11] Yeah, that was also something that I noticed in my conversations with people at DPE was there’s a lot of confusion around regulation obviously without a federal regulatory law here in the US. It is very much a patchwork of state laws. And as you mentioned the European law, so there’s definitely still a lot of seems to be confusion around that but you know on that note were there any discussions that stood out to you on how the regulatory landscape is adapting to new digital Innovations? [19:43] Well just in maybe this is a slight step backwards, but one of the things in terms of that adapting, right? I think one of the successful strategies is really doubling down on active signals for patients and caregivers particularly, right? [19:59] There’s still a lot of ways that we know that these audiences are raising their hands right? Whether they’re participating in advocacy discussions, whether they’re actively searching on certain terms or in certain themes and I think one of the tricks up our sleeve that we have is utilizing AI to efficiently kind of break down everything that we know about that audience right and creating a model that respects privacy, but still provides some of that initial assumption for how they operate right? How are they thinking at scale? Where are the sources that matter most to them? What do they trust most? What are the barriers? What are they’ve been let down by right in the marketplace and then allowing that model to continue to get smarter by feeding it back information on where they’re raising their hands right? Whether that’s you know, how they’re searching on YouTube how they’re searching in Social right? How are they trying to forge those connections and find the information they need and I think what that allows us to do. [20:59] Is at least have a solid understanding from a modeling perspective on where and how our messages should be deployed while still respecting the individual’s privacy at a very granular level. And so that from an innovation standpoint. I think that allows us. [21:14] To still take advantage of a lot of the other Trends we’ve been talking about right like having personalized content having more of that content being able to assemble that content in the moments that matter most but allow us to do so in a way that is you know has two eyes on all of the different privacy regulations that are coming together. [21:35] How do you think regulatory challenges will impact the adoption of new technologies in Pharma, you know who it was a few years back. My answer would be different. My answer would say well, I think the threat is always that it might stifle some of the Innovation because there’s a fear of taking that next step. Alright, the no brain wants to get the dreaded letter. I think now what what I walked away from DPE actually feeling more enthusiastic that the hunger is pervasive now to really Embrace this technology. I think there’s a realization that AI is really here to stay. [22:11] You know and even just for my personal standpoint thinking about some of the digital Innovations lately, like, you know cryptocurrency things of that sort. You always wonder is this is this here to stay right or is this or is this going to be more a momentary flash in the pan? [22:25] I think now you’re starting to see the collective realization that this is something special and it really could be life-saving for patients and allow us to be faster and smarter in a world that’s increasingly digital. So I think we are going to start to see is what Matt was alluding to before stronger Partnerships with regulatory more open-mindedness to how machine learning operates and how you know real-time content assemblage. [22:56] Can be approved and I also think something we haven’t touched on as much here. You’re going to start to see more recognition and realization that Investments and infrastructure matter, you know, and that and that’s one of the questions that I got asked directly on my panel is hey, all of the omnichannel components are great. But can we talk about what’s required to actually bring it to life and I think that’s the other area that organizations are increasingly going to be more open to spending right to enable some of those Technologies behind the scenes that allow us to call back approved assets bring them into Market ad serve them effectively, right? There’s a lot of those other steps that have to be accomplished. It was interesting. One of the sessions specifically talked about the AI bubble and talked about hype bubbles in general but put them into two categories ones where the bubbles that pop right resolver mentioned you have Bitcoin or altcoins nfts Internet of things. They’re things that were so [23:56] huge and and we don’t hear much of them today, but then there’s the bubbles that remain the bubbles that persist they’re the things like [24:03] Calm Health wearables and apps [24:06] Many of them went away, but all those things are still very much in our lives and it’s the ones that succeed and rise to the top that do remain with us and the consensus was AI is going to be one of those those that Implement AI in a way that is helpful to us that is constructive. Those are going to remain there’s going to be a lot of you know, AI nonsense left in its wake but it’s it’s going to be one of those those bubbles that the best remain [24:32] And speaking of Partnerships with Regulators digital farming East highlight any other interesting collaborations or Partnerships that you think are driving change in the industry. Yeah, an interesting one I heard and it was kind of sidestepping a little bit was in the space of influence and over the last I guess this is about two years. Now. One of the biggest influencer spaces opened up is Partnerships with college sports figures. [25:01] And it really marries in two areas one. It’s a it’s a whole new sports influencer area that you can tap into. [25:07] 2 is unlike professional sports influencers, they may not have the millions or tens of millions of followers, but that’s okay because that marries up with another theme that was pervasive throughout DPE when it came to influencers and that’s micro targeting using micro influencers or Nano influencers. And that’s exactly what these sports figures present. It’s a very Niche audience and they are if they’re that good they’re only going to rise their influence in their Fame is only going to rise but they allow you the opportunity to home in on a very target audience to them. And I mean we’re talking about thousands and thousands of different college sports figures so good on them that they’re finally, you know, getting a chance to pay off their college debt, but yeah college sports is a huge area that is going to be great for influence or targeting. [25:58] well, and I love the idea of influencer targeting for Pharma essentially Full Stop on because I think [26:05] it allows you. [26:08] A way of really getting at a specific audience because for those influencers are speaking of very specific language, right and Matt brought up one example from from College athletics, but they’re influencers who are hcp’s right. They’re influencers who are Specialists or NPS. They’re influencers that talk to very specific conditions and segments and by partnering with them. It allows you to have that much more of an idea of exactly where your audience is right again. [26:39] Still maintaining that respectful balance of the privacy concerns. And so I think the more that we can create essentially entire influencer type plans for Brands the more successful they’ll be particularly as we know the younger Generations as they come up. They searched a lot on social they’re looking for videos. They’re looking for shorts. They’re looking for opinion pieces that are quick and impactful from personalities that they align to and personalities that they trust and so what better way if you’re a brand and you want to be authentic and you want to have that conversation and show an audience that you’re there to provide support for the long term and to have a presence what better way than to partner with folks that have already achieved that right and Achieve that with the very specific audience that you’re looking for. Yeah, and it was clear that Pharma is very much on board with influencer marketing and they know that it’s also one of their riskiest areas that they can do but one pointed out [27:39] Out that there is a greater risk with not tapping into these audience then tapping into this audience thought that was pretty prophetic for sure. Yeah, and I think you know, you mentioned this idea of micro-influencers kind of reaching these Niche audiences. That’s also super relevant for health given there’s so many rare disease so many rare diseases and a lot of people with very specific conditions and you’d be surprised what you can find on tiktok. You can find patient influencers for so many different conditions. There’s just a vast amount of content out there and growing influencers as well. [28:12] Looking ahead. What would you say are the biggest challenges that the Pharma industry is facing in embracing digital transformation? Yeah for my part. I would go back to the mlr bottle neck they are willing and able and what to be there for it and with it, but it’s it’s going to take a big change in how to get so much. [28:39] Speed to Market AI generated content through that last Mile in a system that was built in this way. Another great line that I posted this on LinkedIn was [28:54] We have to be okay with imperfection in our industry and trying these things out and trying to experimenting with new omnichannel options ai-driven audience targeting, but that is really difficult to do in an industry whose product is based on absolute perfection. [29:12] Years of study years of research have to get this molecule or this biologic absolutely right? It’s messaging absolutely right and regulated. So it’s tough with that mindset. [29:23] To go forward in uncharted waters when it comes to technology and marketing. [29:28] Yeah, and I would say adding on to the mlr challenges just to just to touch on it again really is the infrastructure component and the willingness to accept and Define what success is in terms of increments and phases for a lot of these brands that want to embrace felony Channel. It does become a shock when you look at all of the investment needed on the tech stack side, but also internally on how assets are reviewed just the fundamental software that powers that whether it be a Visa something like that. It requires a lot of time and effort to train on time and effort to install and and troubleshoot and then it requires that trust in the relationship that those brands have with your chosen Tech and agency partners and really needs to be a partnership to be successful. And I think that was one of the themes that I heard as well coming out of DP was the need to really reassess right? How do we come together in Partnership to solve some of these challenges because they really [30:28] Are bigger than any one side consult alone? And so I think that’s going to be one of the key pieces to to continue to Foster. The you evolution is making sure that the all of the pipes are set up and all of that infrastructure is in place to capitalize on all of the exciting innovation. [30:45] And based on what you saw and heard at the conference. What do you think will be the next big thing in Pharma? Obviously AI has been the big thing the last couple years and curious if you noticed anything that you think is going to be that Next Big Thing. [30:59] I think for for me. [31:02] A lot of it comes down to the experience that we want our audience to have and I think increasingly we’re at a point now where that experience we’re recognizing as an industry. There’s no reason why we can’t holistically surround whether it’s our patients and caregivers or https or even our value in Access folks surround them in ways other Industries do to show them that we’re multi-dimensional I think too often we might think of a farm and jingle or we might think of an individual ad and you know, we think immediately lots of bias or we think immediately it’s you know to treat X and that’s it. And I think what Omni channel is providing us the opportunity to do is to really have brands that are more interested in supporting their audiences from a holistic standpoint. It’s not just hey, I’m going to treat you and you’re done. It’s what other lifestyle challenges are you facing? What are the emotional challenges for you facing? How can we support you if you’re an HTTP in writing and feeling good? [32:01] About the support we provide for your patience or if on the patient side, how do we stay in touch responsibly? How do we give you the opportunities to opt in so that we can have a more holistic experience with you as a customer really and I think that’s one of the components that now we’re starting at the technology to do we’re starting to have the openness to think through it. So in terms of the next big thing in farming, it’s going to step up. [32:27] And embrace that kind of an approach to provide more than just a treatment in the moment, but now to actually provide an experience that builds trust that’s long lasting that becomes something, you know, that’s impactful and in life. Yeah, and from my part, I think it’ll come down to also Farm a responding to the new era of search and not in by that I don’t mean [32:53] Google search results are Bing that are classic search but Oliver touch them this earlier is search within content media. They’re not they’re not searching Google and finding things on WebMD or Medscape for their information. They’re searching for medical information on tiktok. They’re searching for medical information on Instagram. And this is the new way that Jen Alpha Gen X and even Millennials are going to be searching for medical news. Pharma has to be their to respond. They have to start creating content in there because that content is there. It may not be there. It may not be correct. It may be dangerous. So Pharma has to be there out of a public duty and public responsibility to be there with their content just like they are in every other channel currently. [33:43] And that’s a great place to wrap it up. It always comes back to TikTok in the end Matt and Oliver. Thank you so much for joining today and for breaking down some of the biggest trends at Digital Pharma East to really appreciate it. Thank you for having us. Thank you so much pleasure to speak. I hope you enjoyed today’s interview with Oliver Nelson managing director at Evolvics and Matt Snodgrass AI Innovation lead at Syneos Health Health many things for listening. This is Lecia Bushak for the MM+M podcast. Take care.